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Asim2

PAKISTAN
Posted - Monday, June 06, 2005  -  4:01 PM Reply with quote
Assalam-u-allaikum ! (peace/safety be upon you !)
First of all congratulations on converting to Islam (I found this fact on the older forum headings ). You have already taken a perfect decision on converting to Islam, so I feel you are really looking for the truth and if you keep looking for the truth Insha-ALLAH you will find the truth about this issue also. I think your intention is to follow what is allowed and leave what is forbidden and if and when you are convinced about the issue you can leave music and if you are convinced to keep listening to music your decision (deeds depend on intentions). I don't claim to be right about the music issue nor can any one be sure that he is right because music has become so vast and has too many types these days that we will have to analyze the effects (psycological, spiritual , body,time etc...) of each single type of music. I myself am researching the issue and hoping to find the real truth about this issue but according to my research till now most music is not good for us at all and I would recommend not to listen to most music but I am no authority. You should just read my evidences and arguments and the final decision is yours.
I didn't follow the special technique of debating with converts and for that I apologize.
First of all, it is my interpretation on the word "Laghw". You can also consult any researchers you trust to have a broader understanding of this Arabic word.

It is actually:
Laghw = "Which neither benefits in the Hereafter nor fulfills any worldly need"
Eating desert may cause you to Thank ALLAH for giving you the oppurtunity to taste such a delicious food created just for you by The Will of ALLAH. It may also have some benefit to your body.

Laghw translation is not final, this is my first written interpretation of the word . And this interpretation is only the initial interpretation.
I will Insha-ALLAH do more research on this word.

I tell you an incident from yesterday . I was thinking deeply how could I find something to support this definition. Then I searched some Ayat of the Qur'an randomly but couldn't find any Ayat supporting this view. Then suddenly this fact that "Believers have sold their selves and their wealth to ALLAH in return for Paradise" came to my mind.
You know , that we have sold our selves and our wealth to ALLAH in return for Paradise. Did you know that ?

Allah has bought from the believers their selves and their wealth in return for the Garden. They fight in the Way of Allah and they kill and are killed. It is a promise binding on Him in the Torah, the Gospel and the Qur’an and who is truer to his contract than Allah? Rejoice then in the bargain you have made. That is the great victory. (Surah 9: Ayat 111)

So our time, our selves, our wealth should be used as ALLAH likes. All that we have including our time , we have sold in return for Paradise. So think deeply on this Ayat.
The place where you can really fulfill all your desires is Paradise and how great would it be if you became the Category A Paradise winner instead of Category B and how excellent would it be that you become one of the top people of Category A Paradise. (details in Surah Waqia, The Qur'an and Ahadith )
Suppose:
life of this world = about 100 years
life in the Hereafter = Infinite
Let's compare
life of this world/(divided by) life of the Hereafter = 0
life of hereafter/(divided by) life of this world = Infinite.
So life of this world is nothing as compared to the Infinite Hereafter.
At the same time the most crucial, important time of our eternal life is the life of this world as it will shape our Infinite life in the Hereafter. Each and every second of this life is either raising our grade in the Hereafter or keeping it right there or decreasing our grade in the Hereafter. So each and every second of our life here is more precious than all the worldly pleasures combined , as it will shape our Infinite life in the Hereafter.
When we have sold everything we have in this world , then it is desirable that we should try to be honest with this sale and spend all the available time in doing good deeds and trying to get a higher and better Paradise . Yes we have some worldly needs which if properly fulfilled will help us strive harder for a better and better Paradise. Food, career, family etc... are some basic needs .
But remember one thing this life is not for enjoying, the life for very.... high enjoyment is waiting in Paradise and very..... high Bliss is waiting in the highest Paradises . So each second you spend on a useless thing is wasting your greatest asset, your greatest wealth, your greatest resource and that is the time alotted to you to show your worth once and for all and try to earn the higher Paradise .

Surah Waqia indicates the 2 major categories of Paradise: Read the translation of Surah Waqia and think deeply on it. 8 selected Ayaat are as follows.

7. And you (all) will be in three kinds (i.e. separate groups).
8. So those on the Right Hand (i.e. those who will be given their Records in their right hands), Who will be those on the Right Hand? (As a respect for them, because they will enter Paradise).
9. And those on the Left Hand (i.e. those who will be given their Record in their left hands), Who will be those on the Left Hand? (As a disgrace for them, because they will enter Hell).
10. And those foremost [(in Islâmic Faith of Monotheism and in performing righteous deeds) in the life of this world on the very first call for to embrace Islâm,] will be foremost (in Paradise).
11. These will be those nearest to Allâh.
12. In the Gardens of delight (Paradise).
13. A multitude of those (foremost) will be from the first generations (who embraced Islâm).
14. And a few of those (foremost) will be from the later time (generations).

So very few people from our times or later times will be able to be category A Paradise winners. So extra effort and great struggle has to be made if you want to earn Paradise A as very few people from our times can make to Paradise A .
(Above translation taken from www.tanzeem.org )
Their rewards are explained in Surah Wa'qia , so you should read the translation of Surah Waqia . But if you want me to explain these great motivating and encouraging Ayaat ask me and Insha-ALLAH I will try to explain these.
Here are some other Ayaat

Race each other to forgiveness from your Lord and to a Garden, whose breadth is like that of heaven and earth combined, made ready for those who believe in Allah and His Messengers. That is Allah’s favour which He gives to those He wills. Allah’s favour is indeed immense. (57:21)
Race each other to forgiveness from your Lord and a Garden as wide as the heavens and the earth, prepared for the people who guard against evil. (3:133)
Each person faces a particular direction so race each other to the good. Wherever you are, Allah will bring you all together. Truly Allah has power over all things. (2:148)

(Above translations taken from www.harunyahya.com)

Again the Above Ayat,motivate to compete and race with each other because in a race it is not enough to just passs the finish line it is important to get a higher position and thus a higher reward forever and ever Insha-ALLAH. Its a race .
Suppose different positions are there after the finish line. The one who reaches the finish line first will get a better position and better rewards.

Edited by: asim2 on Monday, June 06, 2005 4:05 PM
daneste64

USA
Posted - Monday, June 06, 2005  -  5:46 PM Reply with quote
Brother Asim2:
Thank you for your time to think and write a response.
Since you are inviting me to carefully read a Surah from the Holy Qur'an, I'll take my time to do it, and think further questions, if so.
I am also studying arabic, but for now, I am still unable to access the arabic text by itself. So, I'll take the meaning in English.
I am glad we can exchange ideas in a nice manner, Alhamdulillah!
Salaam.
Loveall

PAKISTAN
Posted - Tuesday, June 07, 2005  -  8:16 PM Reply with quote
In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.

I have already given my answer of the question of this forum and want to add as the followings.

If not clearly mentioned in Holy Quran and in the history of Islam about the circumstances of forbidding some sort of music as pointed out by a brother earlier in this forum, we can be facilitated to know whether music was present at the times of Holy Prophet (Peace be upon him) and his companions or not and they had used it or not? I mean to say, if music was invented after those times then it might be OK as a source of the refreshment/entertainment otherwise we might further ponder to follow the lives of Holy Prophet (Peace be upon him) and his companions, if it (music) had been present before their times.
Asim2

PAKISTAN
Posted - Wednesday, June 08, 2005  -  7:30 AM Reply with quote
With The Name of ALLAH, The Infinitely Merciful, The Ever Merciful.
Assalam-u-allaikum!

1. Give me examples of those types of music you think were forbidden and those not directly forbidden in the times of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) and bring clear evidence from Authentic Hadith and undisputed Sunnan. Add some weight to words by using Authentic Hadith and Undisputed Sunnan.

2. Music existed before also,and music exists today also (time is equally wasted today also with additional hazardous effects due to additional technology and additional innovations and additions in music).

3. Atom bomb and hydrogen bomb was also invented after those times. So is it OK to use atom bomb ? Or are we supposed to use our conscience and mind to research what is bad for us and what is good for us.
We have been forbidden all that is bad and if many types of music come in that category we will have to leave all these types of music.

4. Music , just because you like it doesn't mean its OK . You must prove that music is beneficial and doesn't waste time and I will try to prove that most music is dangerous, wastes time, effects psycologically, emotionally, wastes away useful things we could have done in that time.

5. Discuss the effects of music on pure logic, evidence, arguments against music and in favor if you have any for it.

6. Each and every second in this life is our greatest asset, our greatest wealth, our greatest resource, as it will shape our Infinite life in the Hereafter (read my previous detailed reply). This second once wasted will never come back as the countdown to our death and judgemnt moves closer every second. So if music wastes this second, then music is bad as due to it you might fail to reach one of he higher degrees of Paradise or even you may decrease your rank in the hereafter or even fail . For me this alone is sufficient evidence but more evidence can be researched......for those.....still not convinced !

One more thing most music in my opinion is not OK !

Edited by: asim2 on Sunday, July 10, 2005 11:36 AM
Loveall

PAKISTAN
Posted - Thursday, June 09, 2005  -  8:19 PM Reply with quote
Dear Asim2

I think you could not understand what I pointed out in my posts.
SananK

USA
Posted - Wednesday, July 20, 2005  -  2:38 AM Reply with quote
Assalamu Alaikum brothers and sisters, maybe music does influence people. Some people dress the way they do due to music. Some people argue harshly music is allowed. Majority of people do like music and listen to it. It's playing on our radios on tv, everywhere. The question to ask yourself is, is music more important then religion? Do you enjoy it more then your religion? Can you live without it or can you live without Islam? It influences the most of us and it's common sense it does. Some people look for a soul mate nowadays based on the music style they carry rather then their religion. And most of the time it has to be both put together? Which kind of makes it unusual that music plays a big role in today's society like that. Obviously music causes pleasure but what kind of pleasure, necessary or can you control it? Is it an addiction? Probably so? I thought the form of music that was allowed were drums and that's during a wedding. But now you got everything from string istruments to everything. But one thing people should ask themselves if they are unsure or a questioned can't be answered efficiently as to have a 100% accurate answer of right or wrong (mixed signals) , "IS IT BETTER TO BE SAFE, THEN TO BE SORRY and be punished. How sure are we it is allowed. Why do we argue when we think of sacrificing pleasure? If it is allowed then no harm, but if it isn't then what? Why take a risk? right? The only one we should fear is Allah s.w.t., because one day we will be judged for what we did. Is it worth taking a possible punishment? or sacrificing something that might influence us is worth taking the risk?
Nowaday's society and culture can change anything. Is it following non-muslim culture?
Music can change the way we speak and possibly act around someone, the way we dress. So how much power does music hold? Listening to music, is that beautiful to our ears? or listening to the AZAN more beautiful or not as? Listening to music or listening to a lecture? Why imitate non-muslim culture? It's kind of confusing but if a question like this arises if it's right or wrong and a complete in depth 100% correct answer can't be given then it's quite confusing. Have belief and fear Allah s.w.t. that's what I think.

Assalamu Alaikum
xxbasxx

UNITED KINGDOM
Posted - Thursday, July 21, 2005  -  11:21 PM Reply with quote
Salamz

ive always been taught that content is more important than anything else...if its about something like love or anything that might spark some form of desire for lust or pain (eg. death metal or love songs) in you than stay away from it but if its not *and it can be about SO MANY other things* then its ok, right?


i think music isnt wrong if you listen to it in MODERATION (like most things in Islam should be in moderation), if you over do it then thats REALLY bad


and music is a way to relax, its something you do to keep a base to an activity like painting. you dont need to pay attention to music so you can just drift off and it makes time go faster.


if you listen to the Qura'an while you're painting, you have to concentrate on it and then you eventually eiether drift away from the Qura'an and pay no attention to it or you stop painting and listen to it properly.


with music, you needent pay it any respect, it just helps time go faster.


but it CAN be argued that Zikr is a more productive way of passing time but then again, it requires attention. you cant just say Astaghfirullah while thinking about what might happen in Harry Potter next...


so i guess, in a way, music is like a sound in the background when you're talking on MSN or writing an email but you dont need to listen to it ALL the time


there are two times in my life when i listen to music: when im on the computer (because i have Windows Media Player and it makes things easy :D) and when im cleaning my room (because i can think about stuff but then there can be a constant sound in the back ground to provide comfort)


sorry for the long post!


.xXx. Wassalam


Edited by: xxbasxx on Thursday, July 21, 2005 11:26 PM
SananK

USA
Posted - Friday, July 22, 2005  -  1:45 AM Reply with quote
Walaikum Asalaam xxbasxx,
I can see what you are saying in your post regarding music. I myself become unsure at times. In a way you put it, it seems right. But then again who knows? I too over did it with music when I was younger. I noticed changes in me due to it. Because people told me it was allowed but did not describe as to under what condition it might be ok if it was OK, I have had different views. I myself was a very big fan growing up to the hip hop music culture. It held a strong influence in me. I dressed differently, baggy jeans, timbz, long shirts, had a goti, and thin side burns, walked with so called style, and said things I regret saying now. My Allah s.w.t. forgive me for that inshAllah. Times changed and I put this maturity effort in me to change after seein the outcome in everyone else around me and seeing how they were coping with it and dealing with it and what they were becoming. I guess it depends if it is considered influential music? Can it influence your actions, can it influence your speech, your style, your friends, your religion? Or was what I was doing with listening to so much hip hop, simply following non-muslim culture? We even have nasheedz nowaday's with the essence of hip hop. I mean what is right? Is it a popularity vote on what is hot nowadays and what wasn't back in the day. Is what's in nowadays arguable TO BE ACCEPTED today. Was music such a big issue in the past between Muslims? Some will say it's ok, some will say it isn't. But if there is a question arising to a topic that is being questioned about, is it ok to go with it or not to go with it? There are many different views. I believe I do not know Islam like most people that have greater knowledge. However, a questionable setback like determining wether music is ok is hard with different people saying different things. Some people say that Music is not allowed, while others would say it is. It's a complete 360 in differing opinions. Which way to go? Which way to choose? Makes it really hard for Muslims especially young ones to choose nowadays. Is it a matter of self control?

For example: You have gospel, some people in the church believe and cry and feel closer to god through that.

Then we have Nasheeds, some people feel the same way and feel it in their hearts the beauty in the Nasheed about Allah s.w.t. / Islam and it makes them feel closer. Then you have the nasheeds with essence of hip hop that most young muslims are getting into, and it makes them feel the same way but what if a situation arised in that certain Muslim and they didn't have that much interest in Islam? Could a nasheed based with hip hop attract him/her more to Islam through the means of Music rather then The Quran and Sunnah? Its all psychological i guess? Are things with emotion/influence something we shouldn't be listening too? Are things that can change our personality something we should not listen to? Can a form of pleasure/enjoyment be a wrong reason for someone to get closer to religion? Just like magic which is Haram, someone performing forms of Magic with a feat that has no answer to and cause great shock and amazement, attract someone to convert or get closer to a religion/belief/style the magician carries? Can music be used to Call people to Islam in another way?

I hear a lot of What if's with my friends. A friend wanted to sing about Islam in a rap/ hip hop tone and produce cd's to Muslims and non-muslims and to talk about Islam through his singing thinking he will attract people to religion more. Is this a wrong form of having someone else take interest in religion? Should it be by the Quran and Sunnah alone? Which sounds more logical? Is it Haram to attract people to relgion through means of possible pleasure? Many will argue that it's all about the individual and how they take it (their self control). Even the strongest can fall for something influential nowadays. Anything can happen. Worth taking the risk?
Thanks for that post.

Jazakhallah

Assalamu Alaikum

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