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aslam

PAKISTAN
Topic initiated on Wednesday, October 29, 2003  -  4:14 PM Reply with quote
TARAWEEH


SALAMS,
Did the prophet(pbuh) ever offer taraweeh?



Edited by - aslam on October 29 2003 16:15:58
Razi Allah

PAKISTAN
Posted - Thursday, October 30, 2003  -  9:58 AM Reply with quote
Moiz sahib has neatly expounded this issue. Below is a sampling of his explanations.

(1)
Taraweeh is not an obligatory prayer. The number of rak`ah of the Taraweeh prayer is also not fixed. Actually, the Prophet (pbuh) himself did not ever offer the Taraweeh prayer, as is now a regular practice among Muslims. The Prophet (pbuh) only offered the Tahajjud prayer. However, because the Prophet (pbuh) allowed those who could not wake up in the middle of the night for their Tahajjud prayer to offer this prayer after the `Ishaa prayer, therefore it is not incorrect to offer any number of rak`ah after the `Ishaa prayer, as is now a practice among Muslims, especially during the month of Ramadan. There is thus, no harm in offering fewer or more number of rak`ah in the Taraweeh prayer. The Prophet (pbuh) did not fix any particular number of rak`ah of the Tahajjud prayer and therefore, this number cannot be fixed by any one else either.

(2)
It is generally believed that it is essential to complete the Qur'an from the beginning to end in the Taraweeh prayer. This is not correct. Taraweeh is actually a substitute of the Tahajjud prayer, allowed for those people who have difficulty in waking up in the middle of the night - the prescribed time for the Tahajjud prayer. The Prophet (pbuh) offered his Tahajjud prayer with a longer qiyaam [standing position] than was the case in other prayers. This obviously meant that in Tahajjud prayer the Prophet recited a larger portion of the Qur'an as compared to that in other prayers. It seems that this factor later prompted the Muslims to make a tradition of reciting the whole of the Qur'an in Taraweeh prayer during the month of Ramadhan.

It should be clear in view of the above explanation that:

Taraweeh prayer is not an obligatory prayer;

It is not essential to offer the Taraweeh or Tahajjud prayer in congregation;

If no one in the community is a Hafiz[2] or remembers a large portion of the Qur'an, yet people want to offer this prayer in congregation, the person leading the prayer may read out aloud from the Qur'an - as there is nothing that prohibits such an act in supererogatory prayers;

The best and the most desirable way of offering this prayer is to offer it alone at the time prescribed for the Tahajjud prayers.

(3)
The Prophet (pbuh) never offered the Taraweeh prayer. However, one night the Prophet came out of his room (at the time of the Tahajjud prayer) and offered his prayers in the mosque. People gathered behind and joined him in his prayer. The same thing happened on the night that followed, with a greater number of people joining the Prophet (pbuh). On the third or the fourth night, people gathered in anticipation of joining the Prophet (pbuh) in his prayer again, but the Prophet did not come out. In the morning, the Prophet (pbuh) told the Muslims that he had not come out of his chamber to offer his Tahajjud with the Muslims due to the fear that the Muslims may consider this to be an obligatory prayer.

The first time that the night prayer was organized at a mass congregational level, was during the days of the caliphate of Omar (ra). One night, when Omar (ra) came into the mosque after the `Ishaa prayers, he saw that people had gathered in a number of various groups and were offering their prayers behind various imams (leaders of prayers). This situation was creating a chaotic scene. The recitation of one imam could not be clearly distinguished from that of another. After observing this scene, Omar (ra) suggested that those who want to offer their night prayer in congregation should all join behind one imam, so that the Qur'an is clearly audible. He also appointed Ubayee ibn Ka`b as the leader of this prayer, because of his good style of recitation. The next day, when Omar (ra) came to the mosque, he was satisfied with the development in the situation. However, Omar himself never joined this congregational prayer and is reported to have commented that the prayer being substituted is far superior to its substitute.

Omar (ra) directed Ubayee ibn Ka`b to offer the prayer in eleven rak'ats. The qiyaam (standing posture during the prayer) of these rak'ats was so long that some people had to recline on their staffs to keep themselves standing. It seems that this was the reason that later on the rak'ats were increased to twenty-three (including witr prayers) as is reported in some other narratives of the Mua'tta.
n/a

PAKISTAN
Posted - Monday, November 10, 2003  -  2:02 PM Reply with quote
Salam alaikum wa Rahmat allah
I am sorry I totally disagree that Prophet Mohammed never prayed Taraweeh. It was him who had started in the beginning and Omar had taken from there and made it a practice. It is wrong to say that it is part of Tahajjud prayer., Prophet prayed and the 3rd day he did not come of his house to pray lest the people will make it a continous practice and it will become part of the religion.
But he did pray and if he had not prayed than it would not have been the practice of the Haramain in saudi Arabia, as all is practiced here is but Quran and the Sunnah, the authentic one.
Although the number can be less but it is better to pray 20 as was the practice of that time.
I would highly appreciate if the source is mentioned regarding this answer so that it can further verify the above answer.
Jazakum Allah Khairan
was salam
TSyed

net surfing
hkhan

UNITED KINGDOM
Posted - Wednesday, November 12, 2003  -  12:33 PM Reply with quote
assalamoalaykum/peace
i think instead of arguing about this we shud concentrate on the fact how much Qura'n we understand in taraweeh
if we do alhamdolillah
or if we cant understand arabic and try to read meanings before or after, thats fine as well

but if none of these, we shud rather spend that time in reading and understanding Qura'n as it was revealed in this month and we ought to revise it for understanding and practice every year; change ought to b evident in our individual and collective lives as a nation

throughout the yr generally and in Ramadan specially

this was the purpose for which the beloved(Mohammad sws ) was sent for

unfortunately even saudi arabia has not proved to b an ideal islamic state in present age due to this deficiency

just an opinion of a humble seeker of knowledge
open to comments by dear participants
and also to corrections by the honored moderator

regards

.
Razi Allah

PAKISTAN
Posted - Friday, November 14, 2003  -  1:02 PM Reply with quote
The following narratives are from Bukhari

Narrated Zaid bin Thabit:

Allah's Apostle made a small room in the month of Ramadan (Sa'id said, "I think that Zaid bin Thabit said that it was made of a mat")and he prayed there for a few nights, and so some of his companions prayed behind him. When he came to know about it, he kept on sitting. In the morning, he went out to them and said, "I have seen and understood what you did. You should pray in your houses, for the best prayer of a person is that which he prays in his house except the compulsory prayers."
(Volume 1, Book 11, Number 698)

Narrated 'Aisha, the mother of the faithful believers:

One night Allah's Apostle offered the prayer in the Mosque and the
people followed him. The next night he also offered the prayer and too many people gathered. On the third and the fourth nights more people gathered, but Allah's Apostle did not come out to them. In the morning he said, "I saw what you were doing and nothing but the fear that it (i.e. the prayer) might be enjoined on you, stopped me from coming to you." And that happened in the month of Ramadan.
(Volume 2, Book 21, Number 229)

Narrated Abu Huraira:

Allah's Apostle said, "Whoever prayed at night the whole month of
Ramadan out of sincere Faith and hoping for a reward from Allah, then
all his previous sins will be forgiven." Ibn Shihab (a sub-narrator)
said, "Allah's Apostle died and the people continued observing that
(i.e. Nawafil offered individually, not in congregation), and it
remained as it was during the Caliphate of Abu Bakr and in the early
days of 'Umar's Caliphate." 'Abdur Rahman bin 'Abdul Qari said, "I went out in the company of 'Umar bin Al-Khattab one night in Ramadan to the mosque and found the people praying in different groups. A man
praying alone or a man praying with a little group behind him.
So, 'Umar said, 'In my opinion I would better collect these (people)
under the leadership of one Qari (Reciter) (i.e. let them pray in
congregation!)'. So, he made up his mind to congregate them behind
Ubai bin Ka'b. Then on another night I went again in his company
and the people were praying behind their reciter. On that, 'Umar remarked, 'What an excellent Bid'a this is; but the prayer which they do not perform, but sleep at its time is better than the one they are offering.' He meant the prayer in the last part of the night. (In those days) people used to pray in the early part of the night."
(Volume 3, Book 32, Number 227)

Narrated 'Urwa:

That he was informed by 'Aisha, "Allah's Apostle went out in the middle of the night and prayed in the mosque and some men prayed
behind him. In the morning, the people spoke about it and then a
large number of them gathered and prayed behind him (on the second
night). In the next morning the people again talked about it and on the third night the mosque was full with a large number of people. Allah's Apostle came out and the people prayed behind him. On the
fourth night the Mosque was overwhelmed with people and could not
accommodate them, but the Prophet came out (only) for the morning
prayer. When the morning prayer was finished he recited Tashah-hud and (addressing the people) said, "Amma ba'du, your presence was not hidden from me but I was afraid lest the night prayer (Qiyam) should be enjoined on you and you might not be able to carry it on." So, Allah's Apostle died and the situation remained like that (i.e. people prayed individually). "
(Volume 3, Book 32, Number 229)

Narrated Abu Salama bin 'Abdur Rahman:

that he asked 'Aisha "How was the prayer of Allah's Apostle in
Ramadan?" She replied, "He did not pray more than eleven Rakat in Ramadan or in any other month. He used to pray four Rakat ---- let
alone their beauty and length----and then he would pray four ----let
alone their beauty and length ----and then he would pray three Rakat
(Witr)." She added, "I asked, 'O Allah's Apostle! Do you sleep before
praying the Witr?' He replied, 'O 'Aisha! My eyes sleep but my heart
does not sleep."
(Volume 3, Book 32, Number 230)

The following narratives are from Muwatta

Malik related to me from Ibn Shihab from Urwa ibn az-Zubayr that Abd ar-Rahman ibn Abd al-Qari said, "I went out with Umar ibn alKhattab in Ramadan to the mosque and the people there were spread out in groups. Some men were praying by themselves, whilst others were praying in small groups. Umar said, 'By Allah! It would be better in my opinion if these people gathered behind one reciter.' So he gathered them behind Ubayy ibn Kab. Then I went out with him another night and the people were praying behind their Qur'an reciter. Umar said, 'How excellent this new way is, but what you miss while you are asleep is better than what you watch in prayer.' He meant the end of the night, and people used to watch the beginning of the night in prayer."
(Book 6, Number 6.2.3)

Yahya related to me from Malik from Muhammad ibn Yusuf that as-Sa'ib
ibn Yazid said, "Umar ibn al-Khattab ordered Ubayy ibn Kab and Tamim
ad-Dari to watch the night in prayer with the people for eleven rakas.
The reciterof the Qur'an would recite the Mi'in (a group of medium-sized suras) until we would be leaning on our staffs from having stood so long in prayer. And we would not leave until the approach of dawn."
(Book 6, Number 6.2.4)

Yahya related to me from Malik that Yazid ibn Ruman said, "The people
used to watch the night in prayer during Ramadan for twenty-three
rakas in the time of Umar ibn al-Khattab."
(Book 6, Number 6.2.5)

Yahya related to me from Malik from Said ibn Abi Said al-Maqburi from
Abu Salama ibn Abd ar-Rahman ibn Awf that he asked A'isha, the wife of the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, what the prayer of the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, was like during Ramadan. She said, "The Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, did not go above eleven rakas in Ramadan or at any other time. He prayed four - do not ask me about their beauty or length. Then he prayed another four - do not ask me about their beauty and length. Then he prayed three."

A'isha continued, "I said, 'Messenger of Allah, are you sleeping
before you do the witr?' He said, A'isha, my eyes sleep but my heart
does not sleep.' "
(Book 7, Number 7.2.9)



The above narratives give a fairly complete picture of the Prophet's (sws) prayers during Ramadan.

Tsyed

You write: It is wrong to say that it is part of Tahajjud prayer.

IMHO, it is not part of the Tahajjud prayer but, it appears, Tahajjud
prayer itself.

You write: Although the number can be less but it is better to pray 20 as was the practice of that time.

As the above reports mention, the Prophet (sws) did not go above eleven rakas, so it was not the practice of his time. Of course you can pray as many rakas as you want to but ascribing something to the
Prophet (sws) without any basis should be refrained from. The possible reason for increasing the number of rakas to twenty-three during Omar's (ra) time was mentioned in the previous post. There is difference of opinion among scholars regarding the recommended number of rakas in Taraweeh prayer. Some scholars feel it should not exceed eleven (including witr), one group puts it at twenty-three and another at thirty-six while yet another, above forty. This difference is due to the difference of interpretation of the information found in various narratives and it's fine since the Prophet (sws) did not fix it.

The words of Omar (ra) -- but the prayer which they do not perform, but sleep at its time is better than the one they are offering -- point to the fact that it is an allowance given to those who could not wake up for Tahajjud prayers. Also, it appears that Omar (ra) himself did not participate in this prayer.

You write: But he did pray and if he had not prayed than it would not have been the practice of the Haramain in saudi Arabia, as all is practiced here is but Quran and the Sunnah, the authentic one.


This assertion is at best a controvertible claim and hence moot. Not
everything practiced in Saudi Arabia is Islam pure and untainted. Emotional attachment to that place is one thing and opinions of scholars there is quite another, i.e., fallible pronouncements of human beings most of whom are associated with a particular school of thought.

I could be dead wrong on this issue and will continue to entertain views of other scholars. However, the merit of an opinion should be judged after stripping it off the emotional attachment and awe of the scholars who hold it. I hope you would do the same.

May the Almighty help us see the truth as it is.

Edited by - Razi Allah on November 14 2003 13:08:04

Edited by - Razi Allah on November 14 2003 13:10:30

Edited by - Razi Allah on November 14 2003 13:13:16
Razi Allah

PAKISTAN
Posted - Friday, November 14, 2003  -  2:26 PM Reply with quote
Salam hkhan

Your points are well taken. But i think it is equally important to put religious issues in their proper perspective and to try and understand the relative placement and significance of directives and rituals wihtin the Islamic framework, as it were. If someone comes up to you saying that Taraweeh, for instance, is "Sunnah-e-Muwakada" (leaving which renders you accountable), i am sure you would either like to delve more into the issue or accept it as is. Just as you have written that we need to concentrate on the meaning of the Quran in this month, so do we need to learn whether everything dished out as obligatory or, for that matter, as a part of Islam is really what it is professed to be.

Your posts have always been enlightening and i hope you'll continue to share your thoughts with us.

In case i am wrong, may the Almighty grant me the correct understanding.
hkhan

UNITED KINGDOM
Posted - Saturday, November 15, 2003  -  8:48 PM Reply with quote
waalaykumassalaam
that's why i did ask for the honored moderator's opinion/corrections
b/c i understand i'm not an expert in this field(islamic scholar) and i wanted one of u to come in and clarify
as people of knowledge in this regard can rule in/ rule out certain statement more firmly

many thnx for such elaborative explanation and may Allah reward u all for ur time

so is that right that there isn't any harm prayin taraweeh salah in a group(as i said if one can understand Qura'n while listening) instead of not doing anything in that time or wasting time in useless activities as in other matters we sometime do like combined studies for certain courses, collective skill learning etc. to discipline oneself; however it shud not b taken or propagated as obligatory and those not offering taraweeh b condemened

however standing there as a whole nation without understanding looks like an aimless activity really
can we imagine our children spending even an hr in school without understanding a word what teacher says
or us listening to a chinese speech for 2 hrs not hving a clue what the speaker wishes to convey

how wud we like to act in such a foolish way then supposedly being the "best nation" i.e. muslims

but some people argue that even mere reading and listening to Qura'n without understanding makes one earn 30 good deeds for one word?

regards

.
Razi Allah

PAKISTAN
Posted - Monday, November 17, 2003  -  9:20 PM Reply with quote
I am no scholar or anything close to it. I just try to present the gold i have gathered from scholars in the form of my two cents...:)

Let me reiterate my point: It is definitely virtuous to stand in Taraweeh prayers but if an individual has the capacity to wake up for Tahajjud in Ramadan, he/she would be doing the actual thing and hence the need for a substitute is eliminated. Still, if someone wants to offer Taraweeh while also offering Tahajjud, by all means.

The concept of reading the Quran without any comprehension is quite alien to the Quran itself. The Quran never says that it should be read for reward, rather it should be read for guidance to the true path. Guidance without understanding is inconceivable.

The psyche of finding shortcuts has contributed to the entrenchment of various unfounded traditions. One example of that is what you have pointed towards in the last part of your post: reading the Quran without worrying about comprehending its message.

Edited by - Razi Allah on November 17 2003 21:25:52
Nadir

SAUDI ARABIA
Posted - Saturday, August 30, 2008  -  11:28 AM Reply with quote
Is tarawee Fard?
What if anyone skip it?
aboosait

INDIA
Posted - Saturday, August 30, 2008  -  4:33 PM Reply with quote
quote:

hkhan, Moderator, UNITED KINGDOM Posted - Wednesday, November 12, 2003 - 12:3PM

..............we shud rather spend that time in reading and understanding Qura'n as it was revealed in this month .........................this was the purpose for which the beloved(Mohammad sws ) was sent for...................unfortunately even saudi arabia has not proved to b an ideal islamic state in present age due to this deficiency.............


Sister, on what basis was that accusation on a people whose mother tongue is Arabic and whose present Ruler is also the custodian of the two holy mosques?

Up to the end of Jumad-al-thani, 1428, Madinah-based King Fahd Holy Quran Printing Complex, established in 1405, produced more than 206 million publications.

The complex produces translations of the meanings of the Holy Quran in 47 languages, including 24 Asian languages, 11 European languages and 12 African languages.

These languages include Albanian, Indonesian, Urdu, Turkish, Somalian, Chinese, French, English, Spanish, Korean, Persian, Greek, Vietnamese, Portuguese, and Swedish.

In line with the directives of the Custodian of the two Holy Mosques King Abdullah bin Abdulaziz the pilgrims are provided with copies of the publications issued by the complex every year when they start to leave the Kingdom after performing Hajj rituals.

During my stay in Madeenah after Hajj last year, I personally witnessed free distribution of these publications. I collected books in several Indian languages and translations of Qaur'an in particular all free of cost for distribution in my locality. Also I collected one copy of the English Translation by Yousuf Ali for my youngest daughter who is in College, One copy of English Translation by Hilali for myself (as me and my elder children already have one copy each of Yousuf Ali) and a Tamil translation of the meanings of the Qur'an for a revert lady and her muslim-born husband in my neighborhood. Apart from this I also received a mushaf in Arabic while boarding the return flight.

Bookstalls around the Haramain are permitted to sell these books at nominal rates prescribed by the Government run printing press. It would not be out of place if I mention here as a caution for the Pilgrims that there are fraudelent traders even in the holy land trying to exploit the pilgrims by charging exhorbitantly for these publications inspite of strict vigil by the administration.
ibrahim

PAKISTAN
Posted - Monday, September 01, 2008  -  5:15 AM Reply with quote
quote:

Is tarawee Fard?
What if anyone skip it?
No dear, taraweeh are not fard as this is actually the Tahajjud Prayer so it has the same status that Tahajjud Prayer has.
The one who will skip it's Jama'at and will offer it alone at tahajjud time will surely loose nothing but the one who will skip it totally will surel miss a great opportunity to earn a great reward.
aboosait

INDIA
Posted - Monday, September 01, 2008  -  6:58 AM Reply with quote
quote:


.....The one who will skip it's Jama'at and will offer it alone at tahajjud time will surely loose nothing ......


As has already been pointed out by the learned members Tahajjud is not different from Qiyam and Taraweeh, these are different names of the same prayer. Commonly the word Taraweeh is used to describe this prayer in Ramadaan, the Muslims used this term from early times.

Besides praying Qiyam al-Layl in the Jamaah himself, the Messenger of Allah (sallallahu alaihi wa-sallam) greatly encouraged this practice. Once, after leading the people in the Qiyaam prayer of Ramadaan, when he was leaving and people requested him to continue the prayer for the other part of the night, he (sallallahu alaihi wa-sallam) said: “Whoever stands in prayer with the Imaam until he (the Imaam) concludes the prayer, it is recorded for him that he prayed the whole night.” [(saheeh) Abu Dawood, at-Tirmidhee, al-Bayhaqee]

His statement: “Whoever stands in prayer with the Imaam…” clearly indicates the excellence of Qiyam al-Layl behind the Imaam. Thus, even though delaying Qiyam carries special merits, praying Qiyamal-Layl with the Jamaah, early in the night is better than praying it alone, late in the night. This is why Umar (radhi allahu anhu), revived this Sunnah in his Khilafah and the Muslims continue it till now.

Thus I infer from the above that one who misses the Jama'ah forfeits the extra reward prscribed for prayer in congregation if he prefers to pray alone.
ibrahim

PAKISTAN
Posted - Wednesday, September 03, 2008  -  5:24 AM Reply with quote
quote:

Thus I infer from the above that one who misses the Jama'ah forfeits the extra reward prscribed for prayer in congregation if he prefers to pray alone.

I wud like to know your comments on the action of hazrat Umar (rta) when he ordered people who were performing Qayam-ul-lail in the mosque seperately to offer it jointly under one imam but he himself never offer it under that imam neither lead it for people. In fact he choose to offer it individually at tahajjud time.
I just want to know that in your opinion why a great person like him preffered to forfeit the extra reward prescribed for prayer in congregation.
aboosait

INDIA
Posted - Wednesday, September 03, 2008  -  1:35 PM Reply with quote
Jazakallahu Khair.

Kindly post a link to the event from any authentic book in support of your narration regarding the action of hazrat Umar (r.a)

Assalamu'alaykum.


Edited by: ibrahim on Thursday, September 04, 2008 5:30 AM
mbellos

NIGERIA
Posted - Wednesday, September 03, 2008  -  6:00 PM Reply with quote
quote:Siste,on what basis was that accusation on a people whose mother tongue is Arabic and whose present Ruler is also the custodian of the two holy mosques?

Assalamoeleikumwarahmatullah. Dear brother aboosait.I fully agree with our respected and knowledgable sister moderator hkhan. Saudi state has the responsibility to provide translations in all the languages of the world in all times and ages becuase people from every part of the world come there to visit Allah's House. Allah has given them enough resources for this but sadly as it is, our Muslim Ummah and specially it's leaders are mostly busy enjoying the comforts of life.Just being the custodian of the two Holy Mosques is not sufficient. It lays a very heavy responsibility on the Saudi Government. May Allah guide us to the Right Path. Ameen berahmatika ya Arhamarrahemeen.
aboosait

INDIA
Posted - Thursday, September 04, 2008  -  3:18 AM Reply with quote
quote:

........ Saudi state has the responsibility to provide translations in all the languages of the world in all times and ages ..............


I have answered to this point in my Post dated - Saturday, August 30, 2008 - 4:33 PM . Please read the complete post and comment.

quote:

.........our Muslim Ummah and specially it's leaders are mostly busy enjoying the comforts of life................

except people like you.

In my Post dated - Saturday, August 30, 2008 - 4:33 PM . I have written about my experiences with the Saudi Government's action w.r.t. translations of the Qur'an and Hadith and their distribution. Sadly you are commenting on my introductory sentence in that post and not on what I have explained

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