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simam7f42
USA
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 Topic initiated on Saturday, May 5, 2007 - 4:44 PM 
Module 4: Regarding the definition of Kafir
What are the basic differences among the Mushrikin, Kafirs and the People of the book?
As the module repeatedly defines kafirs as those who deny the truth knowingly (denial not due to the ignorance), then the following question arises. How those Kafirs know about the truth in the first place that they deny deliberately?
As for the Mushrikin, they simply deny the truth because of their ignorance and perhaps for their family traditions. They CAN NOT know the truth because there is no way for them to verify the truth. At best, they can be convinced about the truth but not with certainty. So, their denial does not fall into the catagory of Kuffar.
As for the kafir, there has to be a source for the truth which he denies. What this source could be if it not the Divine book that he received? In other words, People of the book knew from their scriptures about the arrival of the last Prophet (swallellahu Alihe Wassalam). So, whoever amongst them deny this falls into the category of Kuffar and becomes kafir.
So, can it be deduced safely that the Kafirs are a sub set of the People of the book?
Please comment on my reasoning. |
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Tariq Hashmi
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Tuesday, May 15, 2007 - 5:29 PM 
assalaam o alaikum
I believe that it has been adequately explained in the modules that no ordinary human or even the Messenger can understand and determine when a groups has become open kaafir by deliberately denying the truth. The addressees of the Messenger are not declared kaafir on the basis of their rejection of the truth manifest to them beforehand either through rational thinking or received knowledge. The Messengers do their utmost in explaining to them the truth under the direct guidance of the Almighty Allah. There sole duty is to preach, explain, respond to the objections clarify their questions. It is only the Almighty Allah who knows and then determines for the Messenger when they have preached to the extant that the addressees are not left with any excuse to deny it. It is at this point the Messenger is commanded by the Almighty Allah to migrate from the land of the rejectors. If the Messenger has enough support to establish a rule somewhere else he does so and prepares the believers to strike the rejecters otherwise divine punishment is meted out to the rejecters through natural calamities.
This rejection is rejection of the message of the Messenger (the source of truth) which of course correspond to their innate guidance and earlier revelations but their status as kaafir is not determined on these forms of prior knowledge.
The polytheists, in the case of the Prophet Muhammad were considered and declared the rejecters of the first order. They were meted out the severest form of punishment. The reason was that the Messenger was raised among themselves who spoke their tongue, lived among them, preached to them for a long time and could communicate to them more easily and his character was more clear to them any other party.
We believe that the rejecters could be among any of the groups among the addressees of the Messengers. The polytheists of Makkah were declared kaafir earlier than the other groups like the Jews and the Christians.
Regards, |
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salahuddinzafar
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Wednesday, July 30, 2008 - 7:10 AM
Assalam o alaikum!
Your definition of "Kafir" is different than what is common among muslims?
Can you please give the source of your definition of "Kafir" and its autheticity?
One more thing that it is mentioned in module 4 that not all the kafirs will go to hell. i want to ask that the "kafirs" who ll go to hell, will they abide there forever?
Also Will all the muslims go to heaven (either dirctly or via jahannum). Will there be any muslim who ll live in jahannum forever?
Muslims and non-muslims involved in different sins like killing, theft, etc which are related to society and not with "eeman", do they both receive the equal punishment. After receiving that punishment, will they (both muslims and non-muslims) go to heaven? |
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ibrahim
Moderator
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Thursday, July 31, 2008 - 5:39 AM
Wa Alaikum us Salaam
Source of our defination of Kafir is Quran itself. According to it all Deniers of Massengers (Rasool) are declared as Kafir & their punishment is death.
In the sentence "not all the kafirs will go to hell" Kafir is in the meaning of non-Muslim & yes they will abide there forever.
Yes two type of Muslims may live in jahannum forever:
one are those who were known as Muslims in this world but their faith or status of Muslim will be rejected by Allah.
the others are those who has done such an act whose punishment is Jahannam forever like Murderring delebrately.
Lastly, The case of Muslims is clear. If the need to get any punishment of their crimes, they'll go to Heaven after getting it & same case will be of those non-Muslims who will be declared eligible of entering the Heaven. The others will be living in the Hell forever.
I hope this will help you. |
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salahuddinzafar
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Friday, August 1, 2008 - 10:32 AM
Assalam o alaikum!
well i would like to discuss first only regarding the definition of Kafir. rest of the things are clear with a little ambiguity.
i was asking about the definition of the "kafir" given by you is that a person who DELIBRATELY rejects the truth even after truth has been exposed to him. How u get this definition? is it mentioned in Quran? verse no and its explaination please.
Killing a person is allowed only if it is Qisas or a person "comitting fasad fil arrz". By rejecting the Prophet of God inwhich category of the above mentioned two categories, the rejecter fall?
One more thing that can we call anyone "Kafir" today if your definition is considered to be true?
Regards!
Salahuddin Zafar |
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salahuddinzafar
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Friday, August 8, 2008 - 4:20 AM
Assalam o alaikum!
I ve been anxiously waiting for the reply.
Regards!
Salahuddin Zafar |
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ibrahim
Moderator
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Friday, August 8, 2008 - 5:12 AM
wa alaikum us Salaam
Sorry for the late response.
As i mentioned earlier that this def. of Kafir has been derived from Quran though it's not present exactly in these words. It means that it's our understanding of Quran.
You can see that Allah has not declared People of the Book (Jews & Christians) as Kafir or Mushrik despite that they have denied the prophet pbuh & they were involved in Shirk. Onthe other hand People of Mecca were not declared Kafir on the 1st day or in the earlier days. It was more than 10 years of preaching of Prophet pbuh has passed when they were addressed as Kafir in the Surah Kafiroon. These type of many hints has led us to this def. of Kafir.
The Rejecters Falls in the 3rd & special category & that's the Law of Risalat (Law for the people of Messengers of God).
No, we cannot say anyone Kafir today as it's only Allah who confirms to his Prophets pbuh about the Kufr of people.
Regards |
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salahuddinzafar
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 5:17 AM
Assalam o alaikum!
Brother Ibrahim, one thing which is still confusing to me is that u wrote
"It was more than 10 years of preaching of Prophet pbuh has passed when they were addressed as Kafir in the Surah Kafiroon".
It means that the mushrikeen of Makkah were declared "Kafir" after 10 years and they were those who rejected the truth even knowing the truth (as per your understanding of the definition of kufr). My confusion is that among these "kafirs" addressed in the sura Al-Kaferoon, there were many people who accepted Islam later (i mean after they being declared kafir). So it would mean that the people who accepted Islam (and of course became Sahabah) after Sura Kaferoon were those who knowingly rejected Islam in the first phase and accepted it at a later stage. Is any such thing reported from any sahabi? Does not this definition of kufr leads to confusion and make the intentions of sahabah doubtful?
Coming to the second part, the rejecters of Prophet fall in special category and must be killed. As per my understanding you mean that the persons who reject the Prophet of their time knowingly are destined to be killed (either by "Azaab-e-Elahi or some other way). And this law is only for the people of that time. Is it so?
Regards!
Salahuddin Zafar |
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salahuddinzafar
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Monday, October 20, 2008 - 4:09 AM
Assalam o alaikum!
Still confused about the difinition of Kafir..... Please reply the above question...
Regards!
Salahuddin Zafar |
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ibrahim
Moderator
PAKISTAN
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Posted - Monday, October 20, 2008 - 6:28 AM
w salaam Brother & so sorry for this long delay in the answer. here is the reply of your Q. :
Your understanding is right about the Def. of Kafir but there's no confusion in it. Surely those people too were addressed as Kafir at that time but this doesn't mean that they will not be able to accept Islam in future. After this declaration there was a period before the punishment. For some this period ended at Badr & for some it was extended to the Fath-e-Makka. SO in this time there were very few people who benifited from it & accepted Islam.
Your understanding about the 2nd part is also correct.
regards |
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Seemeen
UNITED ARAB EMIRATES
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Posted - Wednesday, May 6, 2009 - 11:38 AM
| Just registered and saw this post thought would reply with whatever corrct knowledge i have. kaafir literally is teh person who conceals...in this case concealing the truth...the right path = Islam |
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